Guys, let's stay on topic. You cannot understand the work load I am under here, trying to get the vehicle mods sorted. We already have a layout editor.

scania, I think you have already asked two times before about a map on the floor in the layout editor.

We have just released a huge system "vehicle mods" and it is not finished. So we are not doing major changes to the layout editor, or going to release a track editor in any imaginable time frame.

I'm fairly interested in the possibility of adding a dirt area to the layout square, as a selectable configuration for an incompatible test patch. But that's about it really. I'm also considering the idea of a walled 1km square area.

I'm only interested in one or two small changes to layout square, where a small change can allow a lot of possibilities. Not changes to the layout system or other difficult things.

Quote from numbazZ :

Do I need to manually delete older mods, that have been updated? UZM412 has been updated 11 times today

At the moment there is no automatic cleanup. I'm not certain what do do about that. In theory we could delete old versions after a day or so (it should stay while someone might still be online with the old version). But if you watch an MPR, it needs to load the correct version. So I don't want to be too hasty to delete old versions.

On the other hand, that car has been updated far too many times. It's quite annoying for reviewers to have to keep approving a car every time there is a tiny setup change. Really, people should make a list of required changes, take their time to do the changes and test offline. Then upload when they are happy, maybe the next day or whatever. Though there is obviously such a thing as the need for a quick fix. So we don't want to apply strong rules. Anyway, public mods only really got going yesterday. We are learning how this process goes in reality.

Quote from ACCAkut :

I don't quite understand what's a "smoothing group" in this context.
...
In Blender the model has all double vertices deleted, "sharp edges" set (those in cyan), but not applied on export (the original "skin render" models distributed ages ago had this same sharp edge setup)

I'm not sure how familiar you are with LFS modeller, but a smoothing group is a property of a triangle that allows it to share normals ("be smoothed with") neighbouring triangles that have the same smoothing group.

Consider a cube. It has only 8 vertices in the editor. Each corner doesn't have 3 vertices with a different normal (it does in the 'output mesh' that is ready for drawing, but in the LFS editor model there is only one vertex at each corner). The 3 faces that meet at that single vertex must have different smoothing groups, so that the cube has sharp edges. A cube needs 3 smoothing groups in total. A cylinder would use one for the curved surface and one for the ends.

When you export from blender, you do produce multiple vertices at a single point if there is a sharp edge there. LFS will merge these vertices into a single vertex, but only after analysing the mesh and assigning smoothing groups, so that the sharp edges are retained after processing.

When it says it ran out of smoothing groups, that means that it had difficulty assigning a smoothing group to one of the surfaces. This may mean that a lot of different smoothing groups shared an edge with that surface. It might not be a real problem - it might just mean there isn't a sharp edge where there should be.

You might need your human brain to fix it, if it is a problem. The thing to do, is go into "tri" mode in the modeller, and select "groups" at the bottom right, and see how it has assigned the smoothing groups (they are colour coded). You might find a clue there, maybe something where there are loads of smoothing groups but it's completely unnecessary. It's hard to know. I had a few test meshes for Blender exports but probably haven't covered everything that could go wrong.

Running out of smoothing groups means you reached 24 smoothing groups. But normally a mesh only needs 5, 6 or 7 groups. In 'subob' mode there is a 'compress groups' button to reduce the number of groups without changing the appearance. So it's worth having a look in there to see what's up. Maybe a lot of smoothing groups meeting at a point so LFS wasn't about to assign low group numbers. Or you could send us the OBJ file if you'd like me to have a look.

It defines how far UP your wheels can go before suspension bottoms out (bump stops).

Try enabling "Zero Springs Test" then make small adjustments to max up.

Quote from scania :

I had make the default skin but it still can't found, what's matter it is?

That message means that file is not found in your data\skins folder

Quote from scania :

how to install the 7z file in to the game? I forgot which video said this & I can't found it back

You should not need to do that for your own local testing, just click "TEST mod in LFS".

It could be possible to add something to get the full car name from the server but it'll be a while before that reaches high priority. I think Victor has set up something using http (or something - I'll ask him).

About two consecutive NPL - I guess you aren't using ISF_REQ_JOIN ? Does the first one appear as if it is a join request? I'm just looking for clues. I've got a lot to try and catch up on so it's hard for me to test each bug. Would it be possible to confirm if this is new and doesn't happen in the old version?

[EDIT: This thread was for the test version. We have now released the official version so this thread is now closed. Thank you all for the testing over the past few weeks]


Dear Community Members,

A test version of a new mods system is now available!

NOTE: There may be changes to any part of this plan, between now and when this test becomes an official version.


About the new system and how it came to be:

We have always wanted to support mods because of the huge variety that becomes possible. We thought it could be done after the new version release, with the new physics. That would have been ideal but there is a lot of demand for mods and we started to look into it this year.

At first we started thinking about simply allowing VOB mods, with some restrictions. But it would of course be better if we had an official way to edit and export mods. So I experimented with some changes in the current public version of LFS, to the point where it could load VOB models saved from our development version. It was immediately obvious that it would be too restrictive if we only allowed VOB mods on existing cars. So I made more changes to save fully edited vehicles that could be loaded in the public version.

As a standalone model and vehicle editor was proven to be possible in principle, we got more serious about the whole thing. We started working on a mod submission system, with mods stored on our website and automatically downloaded in LFS. With the new system, you can visit any server and see new mods there for the first time as they are automatically downloaded like skins.

To make a mod you can build a model (3D mesh) directly in the LFS modeller or start by importing one from another program, e.g. Blender, then make adjustments and apply texture maps within the LFS modeller. To create a driveable vehicle with your model, you could either start from scratch with a new vehicle or choose an existing car as a starting point. Adjust wheel positions, mass, suspension, engine and so on. Test the mod in your public version of LFS then export and upload it to our website. Reviewers will check it follows the rules and approve / reject / request changes. When approved, the mod can be downloaded in LFS and used online.

There are some restrictions.

- The mods system is only for S3 licensed users.
- We do not allow real car names or logos, unless permission is proved during the submission process.
- We do not allow meshes converted from other games, unless permission is proved during the submission process.
- There are limits (e.g. triangle count and texture size) so the mods are quick to download.


Changes to hosting:

There are some changes to the way game servers work. We believe the only way to prevent piracy is to no longer release any server code at all (or even support LAN games). For the new version, we provide the servers, using our existing server rental system. Game server owners can use InSim connections to their servers. We have set up internet servers in Europe, America and Asia so you should get a good ping wherever you are.

You can start a free server in game, using the "Start new host" button. But now, that starts a host running on one of our servers, instead of locally on your computer. When you leave a free server, it closes down after a few minutes.

If you want to run a full-fledged server, or multiple servers, that stay online all the time and store replays and layouts, you can use our game server hosting system. You can choose Europe, America or Asia for the location of your game server. The prices are approximately a quarter of what they were before this change.

You can manage your hosts from https://www.lfs.net/hosting/admin

That works for free hosts started from in-game as well as rental hosts. An InSim port is always opened and available to the IP of the user who started the host. If you would like to whitelist more IPs for InSim, you can do so using the hosting admin link above.


How to try the mods system:

downloads, web pages, videos, documents


We look forward to hearing your feedback and seeing your mod creations!

Last edited by Scawen, Thu 16 Dec 2021, 15:50.

Yes this test patch is fully compatible with version V.

Hello racers,

As the mods test is coming soon, I think a lot of old racers and new racers may need to install a new version of LFS, before installing the test patch.

But the current full version (0.6V) has one important bug, that we identified in this thread.

Short version: A lot of modern wheels and game controllers are reported through the drivers as "GAMEPAD". LFS previously automatically assigned "Look Heading" and "Look Pitch" in that case. But this was a problem on these modern game controllers, as these functions were really assigned to the wrong axes. The common symptom is that the view ends up looking left all the time.

In fact, you just have to unassign Look Heading and Look Pitch in the controller axes, but that isn't really obvious or easy to find if you aren't quite familiar with LFS controller setup.

I thought it would be good to upload a full version "V3" that doesn't have this issue. So I've made a new V3 LFS.exe which is almost the same as V but doesn't automatically assign those axes.

So it's not the most exciting test patch, but here is is, for anyone who does want to try it!

Download:
https://www.lfs.net/file_lfs.php?name=LFS_PATCH_6V_TO_6V3.exe (1 MB)

Installation:
1) Move or save the patch into your main LFS folder
2) Double click the patch to extract it to that folder
3) When you see "Confirm File Replace" select "Yes to All"
4) Now you can start LFS in the normal way

Thanks all the for the feedback. I'm sorry, I can't answer all questions as I'm still pushing to get the final important things done.

Quote from englishlord :

Will players be able to make individual skins for mods like we can make custom skins for current cars and upload them to lfsworld for them to be seen by others?

Yes, the same skin system works with the new Skin ID system. Mods have a 6-character Skin ID which is analogous to the official cars' 3-character skin prefix.

Quote from repeat83 :

1. Are new light system can be release without new traks?

No, the tracks needed to be updated for the new lighting. Actually, we may release Fern Bay without a major overhaul, just a few fixes for the shadows. But the other tracks have had a serious overhaul and most are near complete.

Quote from repeat83 :

2. Are new mods system can be release without new light system?

Yes, mods system is coming soon. Lighting system is at least some months away (no estimates).

Quote from R-to :

We are really worried about this if we have to rent server for live for speed in the future. We have here in finland really high quality hosting server where our players can have 0 ping!

We look forward to hearing your feedback in testing. You'll be able to test using the free servers which are just as high quality as the paid servers but without all the features.

Quote from kongle :

it is amazing updates and i am exicted to test mod support.
i have question for SCAWEN, please consider pricing in Georgia since lfs have big amount of fans here but pricing is extremely high for our economy.

Georgia and Turkey are in the lower price category, which is half of the full price. I do understand that even so, it can still seem more expensive, considering exchange rates and earnings.

But it's hard to lower the prices too much as we have to run a service and it costs money. These are lifetime licenses. Most other internet services I see want your money every month or year, so I still think it's good value.

Still, that doesn't solve the problem that it seems a lot of money in some countries. But I do have a question because I am trying to understand better - how much does a computer cost in those countries with economic issues? I'd be interested to know how much an LFS license costs in relation to the price of a computer.

Quote from Bose321 :

That's great to hear. I was wondering, is there like a limit for the with and height of a car? Or, a model like you showed with 9 XFG sub-objects? For example, when you drive a car that's 200m wide or something, it could be used just to mess with people and dick around. Or would such mods simply not be approved?

I haven't yet fully checked the videos, but is it also possible to create a touring car for example? With 6 wheels, or something like a truck? That would open up some new ideas and possible racing classes for truck racing.

There aren't specific limits on every variable. I think we will have to exercise judgement when reviewing submitted mods.

At the moment you can make a truck but it must be four wheeled, as the LFS system has not been designed to handle more than 4 wheels. It might be possible in future, but at the moment I am faced with duplicating any changes in the development version to the public version so that makes it important not to change much in the existing system. We noticed when trying a test truck that it gets stuck in some pit garages. My truck wasn't developed properly, so I can't say whether the tyre physics really scales properly to that size and mass of vehicle. I want to use trucks and karts as reference points when I am working on the new tyre physics. Most likely the public LFS physics works best for car-sized mods, as that's what it was originally designed for.

I think we will have to ask people to test carefully before uploading their mod, and if there are certain issues then warning notes added. We will rely on people being sensible and we believe that most people will want to submit high quality work.

Quote from superlame :

So this will be similar to the downloading skins from the master server I guess. But will there be an option for us ( the mod creators / publishers ) to have the textures at higher resolution ( 4096 x 4096 ) locally.

It may be possible to avoid applying limits or use lower limits when you want to test locally in LFS.

Quote from xspeedasx :

Hi, thinking about this from a Cruise server perspective,

will there be any changes to InSim to support new mod vehicles?
How about vehicle 3(4?)-letter names in IS_NPL, IS_SLC?
Number plates on modded vehicles?

The mods have their own unique SkinID as you can see in the videos. It appears to the user or mod creator as a 6-character code. But really it is a hexadecimal number and this is represented in 3 bytes internally and in InSim, so it fits into the same slot as the official cars' 3-character codes.

You can put number plates on mod vehicles just as we have done for official cars. This is done by adding a special texture name "s_plate" in the "page" mode of the modeller.

Quote from Bose321 :

Is it possible to accept/reject specific cars for a host? For example, people create their own new race class with modified TBO's or something, can you manage which mods are allowed or not via the server, or InSim? Like you can whitelist or blacklist a few mods by ID or whatever?

It's already possible through InSim and it is marked as a high priority task to manage a list of allowed mods in game, an equivalent of our current allowed cars but it's a more complex system. Current plan is a list of up to 120 allowed mods. For first test version it's just allow mods yes/no.

Quote from pärtan :

What about texture sizes? Will it go as high as 2048?
...
From what I understand having tried making vob mods in the past, the texture projection is not based on UV maps, but is projected from various angles? Is this correct?

Also, I think normal maps are a great asset for making optimized and nice looking cars. Are there any plans to explore this?

About texture size, there is a maximum size of 1024x1024 for each png texture. The pngs you supply are converted to dds when you export from the editor. The texture limit is important for fast download and quick use online. Today I'm finalising the total texture area in the export check. My aim is to look at our highest resolution cars, use their texture area (combined pixel count) as a guide, and allow around 30% to 50% more total area than that.

Artists will have to be reasonable, you can save so much by using small repeating textures, for materials like a car seat. For example a massive picture to cover a whole seat in minute detail isn't suitable for uploaded mods for online racing.

I imagine there are some people with excellent graphic art skills who have focused on renders in the past, or maybe cars for single use in games, who will be able to adjust their texturing approach to make huge savings in texture area to make models suitable for in-game download and online use.

EDIT: Forgot to reply about normal maps. I haven't coded for them even in the new graphics system but would like to one day. In the meantime, the material types are very limited. Although we have more material types available in the development version, the public version car materials are limited to MATT or SHINY. And these may be SOLID, ALPHA (transparent with opacity controlled by the alpha channel) or ATEST (alpha test - though this is not recommended as it doesn't work well with MSAA).

EDIT2: Also forgot to reply about the mappings. The UV coordinates of the output vertices are all computed from planar mappings. You can create a planar mapping, to map a rectangular cutout onto a rectangular mapping on the object. It's in one of the videos. The planar mappings can come from any direction. Usually one of the main axis directions but any direction is possible. I know that artists would also like cylindrical mappings, or even manual adjustment of individual UV coordinates. I do plan to implement cylindrical mappings but it is not done yet.

Quote from Drifteris :

I mean, do you bake the skin template in the LFS modeler? Sort of like normal LFS cars? And then how would you know where the edges are so that you could skin it easier? Normally i use wire frame layer if using gimp but these modded cars sure won't have wire frame layers.

I just wanna know how other people can make skins for the mod.

You can create a skin template by having a separate 2D graphics program open, and pasting special screenshots from the LFS mapping editor, carefully positioned. It wouldn't be a good idea for me to describe it right now - I've got work to do! But I've written a bit in the incomplete modeller document.
https://www.lfs.net/ed_man/modeller.htm

The idea of a skin is just that - other people can make their own skin based on your template and upload it to LFS.net in the normal way as they did for official skins.

I already have a request noted to export a wireframe image.

Quote from NumberTwo :

Not being aero overhaul, but can you add a wing to mod car? Is there a property of lift and drag for the wing you make? Can you add a diffuser to modded car?

Or are mods for now limited only to cars without aero?

All features available in the LFS cars, are available in the mods. We are supplying you with the development editors.

People who have specific questions like this, it could be good to have a quick search for key words in one of these two documents:
https://www.lfs.net/ed_man/vehed.htm
https://www.lfs.net/ed_man/modeller.htm

Or of course quite a lot is covered in the videos. Documents and videos are incomplete though.

Quote from kenblock30 :

A question about servers, the plan is a hosting from US? Because always when people talk about America they mean that country and its a large continent so if thats the plan we will get bad ping from south countries, like Argentina, Chile, Brasil, Uruguay, etc...
We worked to make a nice community to run events and this can be bad for us

The America server is located in Ashburn, USA which has very good internet connectivity so we hope it will be good for North and South America. We'll see when we get to testing!

Quote from kagurazakayukari :

I got to say many Chinese players are waiting this for so long... Huge appreciate!

My only concern is if the new master server will creating and running a new asia server that are technical blocked by Chinese government.
...
Maybe we can arrange a early test with. And this could be done after public test patch availabe.

I hope there will be no problem for Chinese racers and mod creators. The Asian server is in Tokyo, Japan so I hope there will be no problem! I'd like to hear from you when we start testing.

Last edited by Scawen, Tue 2 Nov 2021, 09:33.

No, it's just one or the other. I have not tried to support EVs with gears either. I have to set limits to try and finish this and get it out there. I do want to add regenerative braking during the public test stage though.

EDIT: The mods system is ready for testing! https://www.lfs.net/forum/498


Dear Community Members,

We have been working on a new system to support mods. We need a little more time to get to public testing, but there's quite a bit to show you and talk about already.


NOTE: There may be changes to any part of this plan, between now and the point of public testing.


About the new system and how it came to be:

We have always wanted to support mods because of the huge variety that becomes possible. We thought it could be done after the new version release, with the new physics. That would have been ideal but there is a lot of demand for mods and we started to look into it this year.

At first we started thinking about simply allowing VOB mods, with some restrictions. But it would of course be better if we had an official way to edit and export mods. So I experimented with some changes in the current public version of LFS, to the point where it could load VOB models saved from our development version. It was immediately obvious that it would be too restrictive if we only allowed VOB mods on existing cars. So I made more changes to save fully edited vehicles that could be loaded in the public version.

As a standalone model and vehicle editor was proven to be possible in principle, we got more serious about the whole thing. We started working on a mod submission system, with mods stored on our website and automatically downloaded in LFS. With the new system, you can visit any server and see new mods there for the first time as they are automatically downloaded like skins.

To make a mod you can build a model (3D mesh) directly in the LFS modeller or start by importing one from another program, e.g. Blender, then make adjustments and apply texture maps within the LFS modeller. To create a driveable vehicle with your model, you could either start from scratch with a new vehicle or choose an existing car as a starting point. Adjust wheel positions, mass, suspension, engine and so on. Test the mod in your public version of LFS then export and upload it to our website. Reviewers will check it follows the rules and approve / reject / request changes. When approved, the mod can be downloaded in LFS and used online.

There are some restrictions.

- The mods system is only for S3 licensed users.
- We will not allow real car names or logos, unless permission is proved during the submission process.
- We will not allow meshes converted from other games, unless permission is proved during the submission process.
- There will be limits (e.g. triangle count and texture size) so the mods are quick to download.


Changes to hosting:

There will be some changes to the way game servers work. We believe the only way to prevent piracy is to no longer release any server code at all (or even support LAN games). For the new version, we will provide the servers, using our existing server rental system. Game server owners can use InSim connections to their servers. We are setting up internet servers in Europe, America and Asia so you should get a good ping wherever you are.

You can start a free server in game, using the "Start new host" button. But now, that starts a host running on one of our servers, instead of locally on your computer. When you leave a free server, it closes down after a few minutes.

If you want to run a full-fledged server, or multiple servers, that stay online all the time and store replays and layouts, you will be able to use our existing game server hosting system, but now you will be able to choose Europe, America or Asia for the location of your game server. We are still finalising the prices but we are thinking around a quarter of the current prices.


More information about the new system

Downloads: [NOT YET AVAILABLE]

1) LFS Editor - Modeller and Vehicle editor to be installed separately
2) LFS Test Patch with mods support


Mods page:

https://lfs.net/files/vehmods


Tutorial videos: (there are more to do)

1) LFS Mods Introduction (11:49) https://youtu.be/9EPWaGraQfs
2) LFS Modeller Overview (3:30) https://youtu.be/05y8apUWyVs
3) View Controls Overview (3:40) https://youtu.be/As_aPoU2Qr4
4) Updating a mod with a new version (4:06) https://youtu.be/vDSn_XkyGGM
5) Building the Brickmobile: Part 1 - Model (11:58) https://youtu.be/eegTP5mo8Zk
6) Exporting from Blender to LFS Editor (3:01) https://youtu.be/Rf6HK_niFjo
7) Building the Brickmobile: Part 2 - Texturing (9:24) https://youtu.be/_HIrlxJMWnI
8) Building the Brickmobile: Part 3 - First Drive (5:07) https://youtu.be/c9Pi0aYbA0c
9) LFS Steering Animation Editor (12:09) https://youtu.be/JPbMCfZ8VmU
10) Building the Brickmobile: Part 4 - Level of detail (LOD) meshes (5:43) https://youtu.be/DAyiQbhvbYM
11) Building the Brickmobile: Part 5 - Masses and object positions (5:22) https://youtu.be/l0iiQOk_1Os


Documents: (just a start - incomplete)

Modeller
Vehicle Editor


We look forward to hearing your feedback!

Thanks,

Scawen

Last edited by Scawen, Sat 6 Nov 2021, 21:04.

It's the usual thing. If we don't talk, it's "where are the devs" and "why have they abandoned us". If we do talk and excitedly announce things that we are working 12 hours a day on, then don't quite make a point where we had said "we hope to be able to say something on day X" then we get told off again by some people. There isn't really a way around that!

But the really great thing is that most of the community members totally understand what we are talking about, and I am very happy to hear the nearly all positive comments since my last post. I'm working super hard on average 12 hours a day, 7 days a week, for quite a few months to get this current project ready for a public test patch. It's pretty tiring but think it'll be worth it.

Thank you for this information. I've implemented this today so it will be in the next test patch, which I hope is in the next two or three weeks (though my time estimates are normally terrible).

Thank you, I'd be interested to hear when you are ready. No rush, I know that when moving house, this won't be the highest priority!

There's nothing in particular to test, only whether it is working properly, looking 3D and visible in both eyes. Because of the definite fault on MagicFr's computer and the apparent scale issue on bberger's one, it's good to get an idea if other people get the same problems.

Quote from bavabanga :

Hi Scawen, add please 225 front tires for XRR and boost controller, turbo lag on 1.76 bar on 4 piston engine it's not comfortable for drifting. Need low boost for tyre spin control imho.

Hi, the test patch stage is over, I'm back to work on the development version now. So no more changes in the near future.

I thought we were getting past it but maybe not.

Quote from ZanZi :

i cant jump on a 3 day notice to verify a potential gamebreaker is intended to be added to the sim.

I don't know which thing you are talking about. I haven't heard of such a thing.

Quote from ZanZi :

@Scawen, you probably missed my post in the thread where you announced the intent to make small changes, ill remind you that back in time when LFS was in its strongest, the MAJORITY of the people racing then were begging for simple solutions that were overlooked (considering the GTR balancing). These things were nothing compared to what we're pushing back and forth here.

Going back into history with vague comments is kind of irrelevant.

There are thousands of things that could have been done differently at any stage, which didn't get done or prioritised for any number of reasons. That doesn't really have any bearing on people getting worked up about tiny changes they didn't test in a recent update.

I'll say it again: There was opportunity, invitation, notification to test these things. If people didn't do it, and they don't like a tiny little change that happened, it's not reasonable for them to come here and whinge. There is no bug, just people exaggerating problems. It's quite pathetic.

EDIT: Unsubscribing from thread now. Thanks for the positive feedback. I'm really pleased the update is working very well, as intended!

Last edited by Scawen, Tue 2 Mar 2021, 20:21.

Thanks but when I am attacked by random people for no reason, I am genuinely concerned about their mental state. I'm not a whipping boy for people's personal problems.

As for talking about mental health, I've experienced serious depression in the past and I know for a fact that getting out and enjoying nature as much as possible is a great help. I am genuinely concerned about people staying indoors during lockdown and seriously suggest they get outside. It's not a joke that people need exercise. Without it, gradually the brain and body deteriorate.

There was a thorough and lengthy test patching process where people were invited to give feedback. If people with a special interest have a problem with one of the slightly adjusted features, then it really is too late and the correct advice is, next time, participate in the test patch stage.

If there was an actual bug or serious issue, then I'd have to spend more time away from the real development and start working on 0.6W. But there isn't such a problem. There are a few tiny changes that a very small number of people are worried about. It's a real storm in a teacup.

Quote from rik97 :

But at the end of the day we players are your customers, so talk with a bit more respect against them.

Respect is the way I developed this patch:

- Public test patch
- Full transparency
- Descriptions of all changes, with reasons
- Repeated invitations to people to please test
- Attempt to solve every problem and accomodate as many requests as possible

What is not respect:

- A very small number of users who couldn't be bothered to test, coming here very shortly after the test patching process has finished, and telling me I've done something wrong.

NOTE: There isn't anything actually wrong. It's more like a few members playing 'bait the dev' for no reason.

Quote from k_badam :

Unrelated to the current issue, this 'blaming the public beta testers attitude' is totally wrong. The developer is definitely responsible for any bugs or issues in the game, if the community fail to find them it is still the fault of the development team.

To be clear, there isn't a bug or an issue, so I'm not blaming anyone for it.


EDIT: I am saying, that people who have a special minority interest, should definitely have a go with the test patch which was there for weeks. There were many repeated requests for testing, warnings of the changes and so on. So there is no sense in complaining if after all those requests, someone with a minority interest refuses to test the patch then when it is released, it turns out that one small beneficial change isn't to their liking. There's nothing more I can do, than put all these test patches out for public testing, ask people to test them and fix any issues they report. So don't ask me to do more than that.

This is why I'm suggesting, get outside for a little each day. A lot of people have discovered the great outdoors during lockdown, but still more people have not understood that you can go outside, or believed that it is beneficial in any way. But it is very important to get outside every day. Or at least nearly every day, probably not if there's a storm out there.

Last edited by Scawen, Tue 2 Mar 2021, 09:25.

It's your mistake. This is the beauty of public test patches.

Learn and move on.

Also: It's actually a good thing that there is some new opportunity for some hotlap activity. So your failure to bother to test your own special interest has resulted in some good fun for a few people. So that's good!

Seems you don't seem to have much idea how things work around here.

You can only really be upset with yourself for not spotting this during the test patch phase.

Better get over it and go and have some fun racing and hotlapping.